tv The Dylan Ratigan Show MSNBC September 13, 2010 4:00pm-5:00pm EDT
good afternoon. today, let's make an arm's deal. the u.s. unveiling a massive ar deal with our friends, the saudis, the same folks who brought you fund -- what is this deal really about and why do we perpetuate this relationship the way we do. plus, the president hing a frank, unscripted, casual chat with some real life, regular people. while cameras role, reporters package the whole thing for ooefg news. did the president talk about any real idea to address them? reality tv sells better. why working mothers get a raw deal from corporate america. the show startright now.
well, the u.s. struck its largest arms deal ever and it's with a country we know, fun our enemies and may be our enemy. we learned today the white house will offer a $60 billion ariel arsonal to saudi arabia. 70 apache helicopters, 72 blackhawks and three dozen litt for sale to the saudis. also, talk of supplying the kingdom with tens of billions more in naval defense upgrade. the sale reportedly aimed at shoring up relations with key arab allies in the middle east, namely saudi arabia. the country that routinely doles
out amputations, this summer, for example, a 13-year-old girl was given just 93 lashes for having a smart phone in school. women, of course, forbidden from driving. cinemas, concerts in a society banned altogether. howho sexuality is punished by death. with friends like these, who needs enemies. and did we forget the 9/11 hijackers, the money we pay them for oil, they use the money to buy our guns to oppress our people while they provide one of the top sources of terror funding. here to help us understand why we would ever make this deal and more interesting to me, why the u.s. refuses tons leverage agait saudi arabia, bridgette
gabriele. a pleasu to make the acquaintance. to what do you attribute the u.s.'s unwillingness? >> this is really concerning. so concerning that the president is not listening to the warning signs with saudi arabia. this is the country that funded osama bin laden. this is the country that exports two things. terrorism and oil, actually, three things. i believe this is a very dangerous move. it is unprecedented. we have been giving weapons to the saudis for the last five decades. this is the last we take this step in giving them such sophisticated equipment. >> and he's working on a book about saudi arabia's future and what it means for the united states to demonize them or the culture.
not hard to do. the facts are largely well-known. at the end of the day, thomas, do you see an alternative path of engagement other than continuing to buy oil and send guns? >> first of all, i so disagree with the entire premise of the way you've laid out the questions. first of all, we don't get a lot of oil from saudi ara rarabiara. second, we have -- >> sounds like more reason why we should be tibl lean onthem to not be so oppressive, no? why are we spending them guns to oppress their people? >> they dot use the guns to oppress their people. >> then why do only 70% of the people in saudi arabia are not allowed to own a home and that is because the government keeps the money and prevents them from buying homes or the treatment of the women and the rest of it.
what do you mean it's not oppressi oppressive? >> wrong, wrong and wrong on home ownership. i don't know where you get those statistics. >> reuters. every statistic i've found that is not suspect, whether from saudi sources, american news sources, reuters, it's been 25% and 30%. the most recent, 30%. we probably should have done this in the preinterview. do you believe -- so basically, you don't think there's oppression in saudi arabia in. >> of course there is. of course there's oppression. saudi arabia is not a free country by our standards. of course not. but that's been true since the beginning of the relationship in world war ii. >> i know that. but why do we continue it? knowingar -- i think we've leard some information since world war ii about the earth.
why do we continue to same relationships that we have been without analyzing the reality of how it may be destroy ing our on realities. we harken back to world war ii and it's 2010. >> because every president since roosevelt has found it useful. the saudis have been extremely helpful to news fighting a lot of the fights we have fought around the world. they financed the world against cuban influence in africa, against countries in central america. they provided money in our fight against the taliban. >> also provided the terrori. bridgette, if you were to look at the unwillingness rhetoric to accept the nature of saudi arab arabia, what do you think -- what is it they don't want to
deal with? >> they do not want to deal with reality. theyelieve they can continue rkinwith saudi arabia, they're going to continue to be our friend and help with the war. but what war? th e only reason they helped against the taliban is because osama bin laden turned against them. when you look at the middle east, you look at every country as a one-man regime. these are people that cannot be trusted. they export radical ideology all over the world. now, they're exporting out of the middle east and into different countries. they are teaching radicalism against the west, the united states. they are going to brg back oppressing women and gays. these are people we are still calling our allies. when are we going to realize they are not more than enemies in sheep's clothing. we need to become energy inde pendent -- otherwise, we will not protect you because
what we're doing now is by supplying the saudis with these arms, are letting the royal family stay in power because right now, they are being threatened by iran. they are our friends because we are protecting their behinds and they are using us why we can. >> what's wrong with that analysis, thomas? >> it depends on whether you say the glass is half full of emptty. they do this in their own interest. every country acts in his own sbris at the end of the day. it's also true there are a lot of issues involved here, not-t just long-term stability in the oil market, but the contents for regional influence against iran. for saudi arabia's influence over other less reliable negotiating partners. they bring a lot to the table. and for various reasons, including opposition to
communism during the cold war, we have found it useful to, after all, saudi arabia was basically created by the united states. everything there was built by americans with american technology right down to e wheelchair ramps in the modern office buildings. this relationship has been, it's had its ups and downs, but has been useful. it is been written, stated, declared american policy since 1951 not to interfere in their internal affairs or the way it governs itself. that is our official government document from 1951. >> seems like there's a lot of policies from education to energy infrastructure to a lot of our physical infrastructure that goes to 1951. our health care system et cetera, but perpetuating mething that's 60 years old, when you consider how much has
changed, without reevaluating how much we may be destroying ourselves by hanging on to something from 1951 because it's a favor from the cold war. i'm not trying to be facetious. >> we could have adiscussion on this polic but we ought to do it on the basis of facts, not rants. >> i take issue with that statement because you're saying that my homeon ownership fact i wrong. >> yes. >> come on here and discredit knowing my facts, but reuters facts, the saudi arabian news facts is a useless way for you to solve problems. i think you're right that i think this conversation should can ad and maybe you and i get on the phone at some point, review a set of facts so we n't have to arg about the in public, waste everybody's
time. it is a pleasure to meet both of you and i enjoy the opportunity to have some of a conversation with you. coming up, we'll review our facts in the future so we don't waste everybody's time. a photo op to fix is economy. we'll talk about president obama's backyard bull session. might seem more like a reality show tha an attem to dig us out of our financial hole. how are you getting to a happier place? running there? dancing there? flying there? how about eating soup to get there? be delicious campbell's soups fill you with good nutrition, energy, farm-grown ingredients, and can help you keep a healthy weight. helping you get to a happier place. have a nice trip. campbell's.
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welcome back. a whole new way to look our financial mess, the ecomy as a reality show. all show, no substance. the president having frank, unscripted, casual conversations over lemonade with a real family outside the beltway. kind of like a scene from the real housewives of fairfax county, if you will. the president trying to feel their pain. but what about the anger and frustration and his and other politicians' failure to address the real problem? after all, most americans feeling more like this about being out of work. >> oh, that's funny -- >> don't get in my face. >> do not break up my family! do not break up my family! >> oh, none of that kind of drama toy. then again, no talk of actual solutions to the problems that plague our country. just more band-aids for the
symptoms. joining us now, the ceo of fusion iq and reed wilson. reed, how does this play politically? >> this is part of president obama's sort of midterm election blitz. he's trying to really sell the democratic agenda over the last year and a half and it's not that voters are angry about the failure of politicians to address government, the economy, it's about the politicians, the voter anger over the politicians' failure to find the right solution. they've done a whole bunch of things. passed a stimulus package, but voters think it hasn't worked. that's where the anger is coming from and president obama is trying to convince voters that the economy is on the right track. >> how much of thats frustration because the prlems obama claims to be solng are not our actual problems. to barry.
>> i've been getting the feeling since this recovery has been taking place, that a lot of the anger out there isn't aboutst t stimulus or the economy, but it's this residual anger about the bank bailouts and t.a.r.p. tod today, we came out with three rules that really n't constrain the banks from doing anything stupid again in the future. there's a lot of diffused anger that is unfocused. instead of coming on, we don't like this issue -- >> what would the president do instead, but in addition to going out and talking to people. what should he be doing to relieve that anger? >> first, this is a guy who ran for office and was a great communicator and then sort ofdi disappeared after he got elected. there should have been the discussion of here's what's in
that accomplishment ofim the stimuluses. here's the jobs we would have lost. here's the most recent estimate of gdp. we saefed half a trillion dollars of gdp. i'm not a fan unless it's anemic and weak and very unfocused, but it was better than nothing and yet the explanation of what it accomplished wasn't made by the ite house. >> at the end of the white house in the president's defense, no matterhat argument he made, if you just look at the last chitchat conversation i had with the gentleman about home ownership in saudi arabia where i can make every fact, every piece of data appear to be a lie or suspect, doesn't matter if anybody, can explain what's going on and you just call him a conservative, a liberal, a liar, then continue to do what you were doing before. >> the one thing that really matters is a data point that
came out of our poll. 70% of o americans have a close friend or relative who's lost a recession. this i think that really speaks to the breadth of the recession. whether that's anger at t.a.r.p. or the stimulus, everybody ross those platforms knows somebody who's lost job because of this. >> let's talk in reality in your opinion. forget what it should be, h it ought to be. if you're looking at the democrat's rhetoric at this point and the republican rhe rhetoric, is there any that appeals to you as closer to economic policy? >> there was a poll taken by i believe it was gallup last week and it came out that the majority of americans was against extending the tax cuts for the highest numbers, but they allwant to extend the tax cut for everybody under a
quarter million. it looked like that was going to be the political schism. what we heard from boehner over the weekend, mayb there is some room for agreement here. so at the very least, if evybody rees that 90% of the tax cuts will be extends, that could be in that positiveop and people seem to have sort of come to the agreement that he's are good tax cuts. >> anything else? >> the discussion on infrastructure spending was a good move in the right direction. you know, the problem with the last stimulus was when you extend unemployment benefits and get temporary tax uts, when they end, the stimulus ends as well. but when you do something like build the interstate highway system, which we still have half a century later, you leave something behind that the private sector can build on. the private conversation we heard last week was a step in the right direction. pgrades roads, highways, bridges. the other thing that no one's
really talking about is this capital gains tax cut for businesses. bush did something very, very similar, which is an accelerated depreciati depreciation. right now, we have trillions ofi dollars in cash on corporate america's books. the president said if youspend that, we'll let you write it off in year one. no one's really talking about that. >> a pleasure. thank you so much. reed, thank you as well. up next, here, something worse than economy class on an airplane. you didn't think it was possible. it is, indeed. the cattle class is coming soon to an airplane near you. may be the next step for traveling our unfriendly skies. yellowbook has always been crucial to your business,
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>>if you thought economy seating was brutal, get ready for cattle class. that's what we're calling the new design debut next week. behold, ladies and gentlemen, the sky rider. it puts riders on the saddle, then stands you up to support some of your weight. basically, you're on a hump for one to three hours. by standing up, passengers can eliminate some space beeen rows. as of now, no company has agreed to use this -- europe has stated their interest, so on the bright side your seat will be cheaper having to stand for an hour, so it might be worth a few extra bucks if you want to go to dublin. still ahead, momism in the workplace. why many women with kids face a mommy tax when it comes to pay and promotions in corporate
america. plus, the face of facebook. new details about the intensely private life of the ceo who made his money by making millions of americans, or inviting millions of americans, to give up their privacy. did they know they were doing that and his rights to exploit that back now. also, the democrats trying to paint john boehner as public enemy number one, placing him n their version of mount rush more. will it work? ♪
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recently come under attackac fo its privacy policies. critiques allege the site is not doing enough to protect personal information of its users. they posted into the zuckerberg universe, but may not realize that is the domain of facebook. next month, a new film will be released and it chronicles the beginnings of facebook and paints an unflattering image of mark zuckerberg. what is the real -- or who is the real mark zuckerberg? will the real mark zuckerberg please stand up. jose wrote this exclusive profile. congratulations on the pie. >> thank you. >> one thing that struck me, there's obviously the scandal about the information that's noble on facebook and then
obviously the privacy mar of ma zuckerberg. is he as private as he is because he's the only one who really knows how much can be own about everybody else? and he's protecting himself. >> that's actually one of the things that surprised me. he has like 879 friends on facebook and he's actually pretty open about what he shares like with people. like the weekend that his long time girlfrie actually moved in, he wrote that on his status update. >> so he shares more than -- doesn't allow a lot of people to have access -- >> the way i use facebook, i'm pretty like, pretty careful about what i share. i think he's kind of the same way. all of us through this process have learned in our own way rk to kind of manage privacy. >> unlike you or me or anybody
else, zuckerberg, who is the propie of facebook, are we learning the standards of any company decides they want to create? >> you know, this is really a bigger question that's beyond facebook. and this is where i think the generational, which is not to say that older people don't get it, but this idea that now every private citizen has a public identity. that's a big thing. >> your self-expression has become instead of watching television, they logon. >> facebook is television. people on thr blackberries. >> forget that. at this point, had zuckerberg, not by any intent, stumbled into
a very dangt erous area. not as an evil bad guy, but he created a pathway for people express themselves and now, he has that information and what he does with it is incredibly powerful and dangerous and all the rest of it, potentially. >> potentially, yes. but i think the point is that he has become the de facto leader. facebook and zuckerberg have kind of become the de facto leader of privacy. google, right. think about google and privacy. >> i >>know. >> but, but, because zuckerberg, i mean, you know google has -- it's mark zuckerberg, a 26-year-old guy leading this is thing. this is why getting to know him, trying to understand where he comes from is very important. >> the bigger question for me, is it appropriate that in any society, that a 26-year-old young man be giventhe
responsibility for determining the fate of information and privacy pocy for the world and athe same time, be treated like a celebrity understandably from a success and be given billions of dollars. is there any 26-year-old, let alone 50 or 80-year-old, who really is qualified to bare the burden of that responsibility or that privilege? >> this is the orld. the next mark zuckerberg is sitting in a starbucks. >> have we entered a new universe where people are creating a -- an access chain to information that certain individuals, sergei and larry at google or mark at facebook or any place else, can be massively exploited by those indiduals, whether they have intent to do it or not. do we need to address that in some way? >> this is a very big, very big
conversation. when it comes to parenting, learning, politics. >> what's your sense of marks point of view relative to that issue? >> i mean rk i think he's evolving with us. with it. the difference is that he's in control of it. at the end of the day, he's the face of facebook. i think in man ways as we move forward with it, every move he makes, in the article, he calls privacy the third rail issue online. compared to barack obama on health care. i think he realizes the gravity of this, but at the same time, he has made a very big bet. he has made a bet that i'm going to sign on to this thing and i'm going to put my information in and connect with people. >> but is there the disclosure you, this is a bigger conversation. if you're inviting people to self-express, whether on google or facebook. at the very least, do the
executives have an obligation to do a better job of informing those expressing everything that will be done with everything they do on those websites. >> this is a two-way street. facebook and zuckerberg, they need to do a better job of explaining to us what they're doing and being as transparent as possible. >> andow vulnerable you're making yourself. your information. >> but on thether hand, we as users, think about it. it's only been a decade since google, facebook and twit r.ore responsible in the way we ndle it. >> what about a facebook license? >> a passport.lo >> only allowed to start giving your information away, you have to get a license that shows you've been trained as to know what to give away. >> like driving. you can't be facebooking around, ignorant. >> i think we have solved one of the world's major problems.lati.
thface of facebook in "the new yorker congratulations again. now, time again for man versus internet where you hit us withour comments via the twitter. i guess you guys know where i stand. our refusal to deal with the saudi problem creates all these other problemfos. unless we force our own administration to give up on the policy from 1951 or leastal revw it along th all the others. we're really screwing ourselves. you've got something to share, logon, tweet us your thoughts. dylan ratigan on the twitter. up next, our monday mega panel will weigh in. interesting grooming.
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more than $375 million. we've committed $20 billion to an independent d to cover lost income until people impacted can get back to work. we'll keep looking for oil, cleaning it up if we find it and restoring the gulf coast. i was born in new orleans. my family still lives here. bp is gonna be here until the oil is gone and the people and businesses t are back to normal... until we make this right. i know who works differently than many other allergy medications. hoo? omnaris. [ men ] omnaris -- to the nose! [ man ] did you know nasal symptoms like congestion can be caused by allergic inflammation? omnaris relieves your symptoms by fighting inflammation. side effects may include headach nosebleed, and sore throat. [ inhales deeply ] i told my allergy symptoms to take a hike. omnaris. ask your doctor. btling nasal allergy symptoms? omnaris combats the cause. get omnaris for $11 at omnaris.com.
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hate, joining sarah palin, rush limbaugh and of course, the ever evil fox news as republican enemy number one, the president has made boehner a focal point in recent speeches and tomorrow, an ad slamming the orange man. one focus, boehner's supporting the bush tax cuts to the wealthy. this weekend, boehner suggested he might be willing to compromise. >> if the only option i have is to vote for some of those tax reductions, i'll vote for them, but i've been making a point for mohs that we need to extend the current rates for all americans if we want to get our economy going again and want to get jobs in america. >> jonathan. >> dylan, you know, of course this was the opening at the white house was probably praying for, this idea that john boehner would compromise with democrats over the bush tax cuts and
robert gib jumped on it immediately on twitter and this twitter war back and forth between the press secretary b a john boehner over twitter continues up until about an hour ago. there was another tweet from boehner to the press secretary, who is pointing out that john boehner is going up against eric cantor, house minority leader and mitch mcconnell, senate minority leader because they have said that no, we are not compromising at all. so robert bbssays, hey, john boehner, where are you. you're fighting with everybody within the republican party and boehner tweeted back, note to press secretary, gop unified to boost our economy, we need to stop all tax hikes and cut spending now. you know, john boehner, of all those people you showed on mount ru rushmore, he's the only one that stands a chance of being house
speaker if the republicans take over the house. he's the one that would have power of those three. that's why the white house is going after him like this. >> i feel stupid askin the question, but i'm going to ask it any way. basically, neither republicans nor democrats want to deal with any actual problems in this country so they make this look like bunch of jack asses. the democrats rarely in my opinion, just my opinion, actually do anything beyond placate the sympathies of those suffering without actually addressing the core reason of why they are suffering. >> which is why i think the democrats are potentially missing an opportunity here. boehner has said he's willing to extend the middle class tax cuts. let democrats take him up on it. have nancy pelosi say, we're in
agreement for something for once and then force him to go back to his party and cut his deal there. that would show the american people who are so sick of washington and both parties that they're capable of getting something done. >> this is really a side show. the template for the election in november has been set. it's not going to be good for democrats. there's not a great hand if you're a democrat, but we're talking about it. here's what we're not talking about. 9.6% unemployment. >> right. forces me to not talk about what i want to talk about. i want to talk about john boehner. >> andh limbaugh and sarah palin played out. >> i want to switch to a subject a little more compelling for me. but there is an issue with cohesion of the democratic party relative to soothing tension around legislation and emerging
further deterioration in any cohesion in the conservative side of the room. down the list. one member that was threatened, a death threat on another member in delaware today. is that right? >> the chairman of the democratic rublican party received a death threat. >> but who received the death threat? >> the chairman of the delaware republic party. >> from who? >> an e-mail. >> a democrat. >> we don't know? >> presumably from a conservative who's unhappy because the delaware republican party is helping mike cassel against christine o'donnell. >> so where is the -- >> in utah, paul in kentucky, rubio. we're getting to the point now
where it's actually sort of conservative on conservative hate crimes now and i've seen it happen with conservative writers like mark hemming wingway. conservatives are attacking conservative writers for attacking this candidate in delaware. >> if i ask, if i say are you a con tefrtive, yes, i am, what does that mean. one will say it means that i believe in limited government, limited governmentwi interferen with business. i believe in limited interference in social. i go to another, what does it mean. it means all government is bad. it means -- is there clarity and not that you speak for the conservative -- t put lewis up next to boehr on the thing. do you have any insights that we don't have? >> and first of all, if anybody's interested in what a
conservative is, he goes through i think the bullet points, seven to ten things, moral order a belief that freedom and economic prosperity are tied. but look, it's a point well taken. d there's no dogma for us to follow. you're a conservative if you say you are. the problem is that during the entire bush years, it was pr de. we're still trying to figure out what exactly we believe in and who's a conservative. we're going to win elections this year, but we're still fighting about what it means. >> i think this identity crisis has had a partisan effect. you had seven candidates endorsed by the nrfc who have lost their primary elections to the primary incumbents. the national republican senate committee. >> unbelievable that all of
these endorse -- republicans who would normally win -- g >> jonathan, go ahead. >> i'm sitting here fascinated listening to this. there's something else here in terms of the split within the gop and con servetives. the piece talking about president obama and how president obama thinks. i think the republican party is going to have to come to terms at some point with these sort of frge voices. the ideaat that gingrch is e expousing the birther language puts him onf the fringe. i think the republican party wants to be a national party again, it's going to have to stand up and say we won't stand for this. >> the situation in delaware has
to do with credibility. big election tomorrow and some of these fights are going to bet played out. >> i consider myself a conservative. >> i can believe it. >> wouldn't that make you libertarian? >> for me, they lose me when they go to jungle book reviews to prevent the game from being -- when the game is rigged for the lions to eat everything and then you go, oh, law of the jungle. let's talk about something less meaty politically and more cultural. for all the talk of death of old media, apparently, it's not over. 57 minutes per day spent on tv, radio and newspapers. that's the same amount of time being spent on those types of products ten years ago. you say where is the new media?
it appears to be additional time spent, more than displaced time. >> dinosaur lives to see another day. one of the things i think is interesting on where these numbers could change in the future is that you have the largest generation, my generation, that's grown up with those technologies. it's not new and we get our news to them. >> as we move to the older groups, 30s and 40s, large consumers of media, that's where you could see the flip and more people using online to get their news. >> jonathan, i'm fist pumping here because we've been talking for years about how newspapers and magazines are going to go the way of the dinosaur and this notion that we're kind of not makes me very happy and my mom, too. >> jonathan with "the washington post," they have been very
aggressive with embracing the new media. take chris cillizza with "the fix." he's not just writing in the newspaper. they're online. he in twitter. >> the way you tweet every time you look away. it's amazing. >> pretty good, right? >> it means you're integrating these sources. >> cool as opposed to saying, look, i have a hammer. i see a hammer and i'm like -- >> you're building houses. >> let's figure out what a conservative is. the debate has deteriorated partlyor that reason. there's not a conservative voice relative -- any way, my opinion. my show so i'm allowed. it's a pleasure. it's been wonderful to have you guys here. jonathan, you want to show us
the fist pump "the washington post" -- that's it. they can eat it. coming up on "hardball," long live "the washington post." chris matthews will talk about newt gingrich. but first, working mothers getting a raw deal in the workplace. so says keli goff, our daily ranter. ♪ [ male announcer ] at ge capital, y ♪ with clients like jetblue -- financing their fleet, sharing our expertise, and working with people who are changing the face of business in america. after 25 years in the aviation business, i kind of feel like if you're not having fun at what you do, then you've got the wrong job. my landing was better than yours. no, it wasn't. yes, it was. was not. yes, it was. what do you think?
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we're back with our daily rants and momism is the new sexism. here to talk about it, keli g f goff. >> thanks, dylan. for girl powe have scored a major victory in one of the last battlegroundrs f the gender wars. for years, women have been paid about 77 cents for about every dollarheir male counterparts earned. not any more. a recent analysis confirmed that young women ages 22 through 30, are outeasterning their male peers. these women, howeve are childless. it's long been believed that they face a gender tax in the workplace, but these signs show that the gender tax that used to exist has instead been replaced
by a mommy tax.llec so the politically correct thing to say is that it's not an employer's business whether or not we have children or how many we have. we all know that's not really true. the reason, because parenting by very nature is demanding. at least when it's done correctly. women still carry the brunt of the responsibility. let me be clear. this doesn't make women any less qualified to be employees. in fact, many of the same qualities that make women great at balancing mother hood are among the ones that make them such stellar employees. many employers hav been taught though that even asking about family obligations even puts them on dangerous ground, legally. which makes me wonder how many of them pass over qualitied candidates all together. which brings me to last great
battleground. we have more supreme court justices than ever and we came this close to electing the first female president. my point, soon, we're going to run out of men to blame for our inequality, ladies, except for the ones we live with. the only one women will achieve true parody with men is by doing it. so, instead of asking our bosses, how out asking our husbands for more help with child care. only then will we 'chief true gender equality. >> how much of this is a true gender equality issue and how much is a modern, corporate workin environment versus people? >> i actually think both go hand in hand in terms of we've read the articles about how we're melting our personal lives